Compare Menchu"s depiction of the mother-infant relationship with Louise Erdrich's in "Making Babies" how have cultural pressures and opportuniies encouraged these contrasting arrangements?
After your comment, respond to 2 of your classmates' comments.
In Louise Erdrich's "Making Babies" we see an explanation of a westerner's point of view as opposed to Rigoberta's "Birth Ceremonies", an indigenous person. This difference is accounted for mainly because of the difference in culture of these two women. Louise Erdrich begins her story in line 1 saying, "We concieve our children in deepest night, in blazing sun, outdoors, in barns and alleys and minivans." For Louise, making babies is not seen from a serious, religious or ritualistic point of view. Rigoberta on the other hand carries us through step by step how serious a birth is to these indigenous people. Rigoberta makes it very plain to us on page 148, line 10-11, that a child belongs to the whole community. Everyone in the community has a role to play from during the pregnancy stage up to whebn the child becomes an elder. Each stage of the child's life also has ceremonies, rituals that they go through. A child's life is constantly being guided by either the mother, the father or some other adult. As lines1-10 on page 155 tells us that the children are taught the ways of their ancestors and the must live their life as such. It is also visible that the boy child is a bit more prized than the girl child in that apparently he will have more responsibilities than the girl. This is seen in lines 14-24 on page 153. Rosendo Edgar Pacheco
I totally agree with you Rosendo. In making babies, the author didn't really demonstrate any seriousness or bliss of having a child. While in Birth Ceremonies, one get a true sense of how sacred the birth of a child is, at least for the indigenous people. This is noted by the author explaining the rituals and the lives of the women who are pregnant and the way that they are treated. Also the treatment of the baby; the baby is well loved and taken care of from the womb until he is born and grown, not only by the parents but by the entire community.
I agree with Edgar when he says that the Indian people raise a child as a community rather than individually or as just a family, because in the modernized world or westernized as Edgar stated parents consider it their sole duty to raise their child, no one outside the family has that level of responsibility for the child, I think this is so because in small communities like that of the Indians it is easier to trust people with your children.
Well I think Louise Erdrich in "Making babies" is only concerned about the rewards or women having the child and is less concerned about the seriousness of what continues after the child is being given birth to, so is like looking at the prenatal development and care and doesn't really care about the postnatal aspect unlike rigoberta.
I agree with this. In making babies Louise Erdrich is basically focused on the personal experience, the joy, the anguish and the sacrifice made in making a baby. Whilst Rigoberta Menchu, in birth ceremonies, explains the importance of the child and the privilege given to birthing and rearing an baby into an individual fit for the success of the community's future.
I concur with Edgar that In making babies Louise Erdrich speaks about her peronal experience, what an individual goes through when they are pregnant and all the suffering and pain that one has to endure.And in terms of Birth Ceremonies Rigoberto talks about a child being dor the entire community and not only for the parents.The community is now being involve in the childs life
I personal agree with what edgar is saying for both "making Babies" & "Birth Ceremonies", but at the same time both authors are sharing personal experience. However, I’ve noticed similarities between the two stories; both women are mothers, giving each their own standpoint on childbearing. Although both mothers are from different backgrounds, they both view women as strong individuals.
In both stories the authors view the mother-infant experience differently due to their culture. In making babies, Louise Enrich expresses the personal emotional experience whilst in birth ceremonies Rogoberta Menchu views the importance of the experience. In the western culture for Louise Enrich, conception is viewed as a chance, whilst for the Mayans it is viewed as something important to be celebrated. The western culture focuses on the personal emotional experience of the conception, the pregnancy, the birth and the rearing as something that takes place in the blink of the eye. Whilst the Mayan culture sees each phase as something to be celebrated and an opportunity to develop the child into a great member of their community. The western culture allows the mother the opportunity to freely choose from all different options, to handle her child, pregnancy, labor and rearing. Whilst in the Mayan culture their are strict guidelines and less choices. Both culture see the parent as the important factor in carrying, nurturing and rearing the child. For the western civilization the biological mother and father takes all responsibilities, experiences and expenses. For the Mayan cultures the community is seen as a family with the leaders as the parents and the citizens as the children thus from the moment a woman conceives the leaders(parents), are told and the pregnancy is celebrated by the entire community as this pregnant will add another member to the family. Both women has followed the culture passed down from their mothers. Both women see pregnancy physical and spiritual, Rigoberta sees it as more spiritual because of the culture she was brought up in. Both senarios are based on the culture of the area and thus is seen as the right thing to be done.
In “Making Babies”, Louise Erdrich expresses herself from a westerner’s point of view. Erdrich speaks about how child birth is looked at today in the western part of the world. She discusses the pain and suffering that a woman goes through when giving birth to a child. She talks about the different phases a woman go through when she is pregnant such as, always eating, the cravings, sleeping, the weight gain and the actual act of giving birth “labor.” On page 104, 2nd paragraph Erdrich mentioned “It is a true pain one is attempting to endure in drugless labor, not “discomfort,” and the way to deal with pain is not to call it something else but to increase in strength, to prepare the will. Women are strong, strong, terrible strong. We don’t know how strong we are until we’re pushing out our babies.” For the most part, Erdrich focuses more on the depressing aspect of child birth (the pain and the changes a woman body goes through) and not of the bliss that women experiences when giving birth and after. Rigoberta Menchu on the other hand in “Birth Ceremonies” views child birth as a sacred act. Her Maya culture, which is very different from the westerner’s, view childbirth as a blessing and doesn’t put too much emphasis on the pain and difficulty of giving birth. You will note that in “Birth Ceremonies” there is a depiction to “Making Babies” of just how strong women are. Page 148, paragraph 2, when Menchu speaks about how her mother hang a rope from the roof and pulled her pregnant sister up and her sister gave birth in that position. This speaks true of just how strong a woman is. A woman has to be extremely strong to give birth while hanging from a roof. However; the difference is, they embrace that pain and teach their children from a very young age embrace it too. On page 151, line 19, Menchu said “To us, suffering is our fate, and the child must be introduced to the sorrows and hardship, but he must learn that despite his suffering, he will be respectful and live through his pain.” This is something that they have accepted. The children in the western part of the world are rarely brought up with these values. It is also noted on page 148, line 9, when a child is born, it is very significant to the community as it belongs to the community. The community assists in raising that child. Once upon a time, it was the same in the western world, now it is everyone for themselves, everyone wanting to do their own thing. It simply boils down to traditions and keeping true to your culture. For many the customs and values are lost. Althea Sebastian
Hi Althea, Quite interesting piece of work. I just want to disagree slightly with you on a point that you made. In your observations you stated,"and not the bliss that women experience when giving birth and after." Why do I disagree with this part statement? Well, even from Erdrich's point of view, after all the pain and suffering, the end result is that, a baby, god's greatest gift to a woman. As Erdrich comments on line 14-15 page 112, "for even though it wants at times to lie down and quit, the body(female body) is an honest hardworking marvel that gives everything to this one task...(That of giving birth. Rosendo Edgar Pacheco with my five cents.
I agree with you when you say that Louise focuses on the depressing part about child labor, but Menchu also gives a sense of sadness because Indians consider the suffering that they are bringing the child into and they feel saddened by this thought.
This is true that we have lost a sense of community and belongingness, especially in Belize. I have always admired the Cayo community, they are always united, they celebrate festivals together, they celebrate religious ceremonies together, and as seen recently they stand strong together against crime. I think it is a good practice for the rest of the country to pick back up.
I appreciated that you noted that the Quiche Maya group teach their children to embrace pain and build their endurance and perseverance. I see this as a good idea to adopt since it is realistic and might make a person feel like less of a victim or helpless when unfavorable situations arise. Page 151 states they share about "the suffering of the family". Even though they are talking about suffering, this statement still provides reassurance that they are not alone and it promotes unity.
In Rigoberta Mencu’s depiction of mother infant relationship you see a much deeper bound with mothers of Maya decent even from the first weeks of pregnancy these mothers speak to their developing fetuses, they explain to their babies their way of life, they are basically trying to instill in them norms, mores, and cultural values before they child is even born. A clear contrasting view of this can be seen when you Compare “Birth Ceremonies” to “Making babies” the mother in making babies complains about being treated like babies themselves, in the modern Americanized societies pregnant woman are seen as delicate and weak and as such they should not be exposed to hard labor while pregnant, this is stated on page 104 line 26-27. But on the other hand in the Indian community women continue to work hard when pregnant they say this is to get the baby accustomed to the life of hard work that it will be born into this is also stated on page 149 line 37-39. In the modernized world, cultural norms state that women who have just given birth can allow anyone to view the baby almost immediately after delivery, but in the Indian community the mother and child most spend 8 days alone, this is a bounding period between mother and child where not even her other children can see the child beforehand this is a cultural pressure that states that mother be alone with her offspring. In addition other cultural pressures include the Indian mother having the child outside of a hospital this is considered the norm for them to berth a child, while on the other hand in the developed world it is considered a must and a matter of safety to have a child in a hospital because of complications that might occur during labor. The Indians do share a common trait with modernized people which are to baptize the baby. Another sharp contrast between the two is that the Indians believe that the child belongs to the community it learns the traditions ceremonies, responsibilities, Morales etc from the community, while in the modernized world parents believe they or just the family is responsible for the child, and teaching it right from wrong. Also the Indians bounds the babies hands which seems to be a bit ruff while in making babies the treat the baby with care. Another example of cultural pressure would be the mood that is set at the time of birth, in the Indian society there is a feeling of sorrow because they believe they are bringing the baby into a world of suffering, while on the other hand modernized parents have a feeling of happiness when a baby is born. In terms of opportunities that influence both these societies, in the Indian society they seem to encourage poverty or living a simple life, they encourage their children not be corrupted by worldly positions, and in the modernized world or the making babies story the mother looks forward to their child’s accomplishments finishing school, having a successful life which is the complete opposite of what the Indians want.
I agree with what you're saying about the similarities of both the Maya and the modern societies wanting to teach the child morals and values, as do all parents want the best for their children. However, you mentioned that the Maya encourage poverty, I would have to disagree with you there.
The Maya own their land, they work the land and live off of it. They have food to eat, food that they've grown themselves, they just choose to consume little of it. They make their own clothing and their children are educated based on their own teachings, and to them grow to have enough wisdom to lead the community.
They are not impoverished people nor do they live 'a simple life' because they are hard-working people- as Menchu stated even through pregnancy the women are working hard, and they too have sorrow and trial times.
when compared to modern societies, they do seem a little 'unsophisticated' and 'savage-like' in their choice of living,but is it because we do not understand why they choose to live that way? After all their reasons for doing certain practices are a secret.
I have to AGREE to Shauniece Heusner that Mayans don't encourage poverty. In contrast, they are mostly hard working peasants who eat what they have grown. This is sustainability of life. And I totally admires and respect that.
After seeing the videos Mr. Tucker posted here, Menchu had mentioned about the savage reality of modernized world and bubbling wealth. There are people in different world consuming different amount of water per day. Some people over-consumed them, and some under-consumed them. This phenomena let us know that indeed modernized society are abundant with everything we want and need. However, people nowadays abuse it and waste it so much that the earth is now suffering imbalance. One example everyone should know is Global Warming. It is caused by modernized lifestyles and high-technology.
Hi Robert, I enjoyed reading your review. I agree with you for the most part, but I just want to add a few observations of my own. According to Menchu, the maya bring the child into a world of suffering and that is why from the moment that baby is concieved the maya women are there talking to the fetus, guiding it through, teaching them their cultures etc, so that when that baby is born it will be equipped to deal with their way of life. As for Erdrich, maybe western women don't really do a lot of teaching or guiding to their fetus but they do talk to their fetus. Pregnant women are extremely careful as to what they eat, how much they eat etc, all because they want a healthy child to be born who will be able to withstand the forces of nature in the real world. Pacheco here with my five cents.
Rigoberta Menchu’s “Birth Ceremonies” depicts the traditions and beliefs of pregnancy and birth from an indigenous Quiche Maya of Guatemala’s perspective. These traditions and beliefs were held secret to the Quiche Maya, for fear that anyone on the outside could use them against the Maya people. “Learn to protect yourselves by keeping our secret”- Popul Vuh. The Quiche Maya take their teachings quite serious and so her entire chapter is based on the ceremonies carried out by the Quiche Maya to celebrate the coming of a new child to their community. Some of these traditions are to teach the unborn infant the way of life from inside the womb. A Quiche Maya’s life is hard and so they must learn of hard work before being born- as the mother will continue her hard day’s labour throughout the pregnancy. During childbirth, the placenta is burned and not buried to respect the earth and when the child is born they are taught to respect the earth also. Louise Erdrich’s “Making Babies” starts out with her saying “We have no rules, no ceremonies, we don't even need a driver's license”, meaning that when it comes to conception and birth, the modern society foregoes any traditions or beliefs. This is completely opposite of what Menchu describes in her chapter. Instead of highlighting traditions, she highlights the emotions of a mother during her pregnancy. The morning sickness, the cravings, the hormones. Even during birth, she speaks on the pain that the mother feels, the decision to have surgery or medication based on emotions again. When the child is born, Erdrich once again highlights the joy and pleasure of the child to the mother. However, I’ve noticed similarities between the two stories, both women reminisce of their mothers’ standpoint on childbirth. Both mothers, although coming from two completely different backgrounds, hold women as strong individuals Menchu’s mother encourages her daughter to give birth in an upright position, and Erdrich’s mother encourages her daughter to have a natural birth with no medication. Another similarity is that both women speak of the mother’s in the story as people who love and want to nurture their unborn child. Erdrich speaks about quitting the unhealthy habits such as smoking and incorporating a more balanced and healthy diet to develop a strong healthy child. Menchu speaks about the mothers eating the leaves that contain vitamins, and taking the baths “infused with evergreens” to help relax the mother so that the child is not harmed after a long day of work. Also, both women speak about the child becoming a part of a bigger whole. Menchu speaks of the child becoming a part of the community and Erdrich speaks of the child becoming a part of the family. Because of the cultural teachings’ strong influence on the Maya, they view birth as a fulfillment of life and a growth and inclusion of their tight-knitted society. The birth of a child means that they as a people have become stronger and thus their wisdoms, principles and beliefs become stronger. The birth of a child today in the modern societies, according to Erdrich, means that there is also fulfillment at the end, however; this is the fulfillment of a mother and the unforgettable experience she most go through to receive the pleasure of bringing a child of her own into the world.
I really enjoyed the contrast you made between the end of your first paragraph and the beginning of the second. If we were to answer the question in one sentence, those lines would probably be the best to go about doing so. Menchu stressed how important respecting the Earth and nature is to her culture and she elaborated on doing things according to tradition. On the other hand, Erdrich's writing certainly didn't began by proposing that things in her environment are done or should be done in a planned, specific or detailed order.
I like the way you give the clear comparisons about the "Birth Ceremonies" and "Making Babies". There are some similarities that I may have overlooked.
Based on your paragraph, I would conclude that a contrast is that Mayan culture about baby birth and growth are based on a community family point of view while Erdrich's modernized way of baby birth and growth are based on more personal point of view. One similarity is that both signified women as strong when giving birth and that babies must received health care during pregnancy.
I really like the step by step details of similarity between the two stories. I do agree that the Quiche Maya take their culture very seriously and also the way how you noted that the “entire chapter is based on the ceremonies carried out by the Quiche Maya to celebrate the coming of a new child to their community”. What caught my attention is the identification that Menchu highlighted traditions whereas Erdrich highlighted the emotions of a mother during her pregnancy.
“Making Babies” and “Birth Ceremonies” are both written by women who are sharing their personal experiences and observations regarding birth. Similarities are noticeable in both excerpts; still, there are several differences. For instance, there is a contrast between the preparations that are made during pregnancy to welcome the child into the world. On page 147 of “Birth Ceremonies” readers are informed that the mother tells the child how hard life is and apparently acknowledges negative forces that are present (para. 2). In contrast, “Making Babies” has a more optimistic point of view about life itself once the baby has been born. The parents in Menchú’s writing are sad that they have brought a child into the world to suffer (p. 151); on the other hand, this thought seems to be absent when Erdrich gives birth. It is more reasonable to say that Erdrich chooses to elaborate on the suffering and discomfort the mother endures rather than the potential difficulties the child will face later on in life. Also, the children are more aware and informed about exactly when there is a birth in “Making Babies”. Conversely, in “Birth Ceremonies” only the parents know about the baby’s birth (p. 149). The baby is integrated slowly into Quiché families compared to other cultures since “the newborn baby should be alone with his mother in a special place for eight days” (p. 150).Greater emphasis is also placed on the individuals who are present at the time of birth in indigenous communities. Compared to the mother-infant relationship in “Making Babies”, mothers in Maya families are much more detailed when it comes to explaining the significance of their actions to their children and what their responsibilities are because of the complex symbolism that is an element of their culture. Clearly, “Birth Ceremony” highlights that the cultural pressures that exist cause the focus to be more on the community’s relationship with the child and not just the mother-infant relationship. Perhaps some of these customs like hiding a baby’s birth stem from their Sacred book in which they are advised not to share unnecessary information with people who do not belong to their community. Hence, the opportunities that others had of influencing them caused them to feel that they could protect themselves through secrecy and by imitating their ancestors.
Hi Karina, I enjoyed reading your comparisons based on two diverse cultural practices of baby birth.
I would like to add some more points to your view.
Menchu emphasize mostly about a child's growth when he/she was born while Erdrich emphasize mostly about a child's formation in mother's womb. Therefore, Menchu depicted ceremonies of a child from when he's born until when he's a grown up person. On the other hand, Erdrich depicted the stages of pregnancy and what she experiences during the process of pregnancy.
I would say I kind of like Quiche's way of teaching their kids to become an honest and respectable being since birth. Also, Erdrich's detailed explanation about stages of pregnancy makes me aware of things I've never experienced.
Menchu’s depiction of “Birth Ceremony” as opposed to Erdrich’s “Making Babies” both are talking about the importance of a child’s birth. However, the extremely varied cultures and lifestyles foster children in different ways.
Rigoberta Menchu Tum, the author of “Birth Ceremonies”, is a Mayan of Guatemala’s Quiche group. In her narrative, the child must go through many cultural ceremonies before and after he/she was born. For an instance, mother must guide and talk to the baby in the belly about the life he/she will live in and what sufferings he/she will endure like how the mother and the ancestors did (pg. 147, para.2). Mayan believes in Sun, Moon, and God as well as respects beans, maize, plants, and earth. They believe that all the generations must follow the exact footsteps of their ancestors with obliged to the community. Menchu stated that ceremonies for birth for male and female may be slightly different since males carry more responsibilities when they’re born. Males are given extra day alone with his mother when he’s born as opposed to usual 8 days alone. He also gets more food than usual custom of killing a sheep or some chickens. However, females are equally important as they carry different responsibilities such as multiply the life of their generation (pg. 153, para. 3). Mayan children are said to belong to the community and not merely their parents. They are born to serve the community and pass their secret cultures down as well as to avoid any intruder. Their elected leader is responsible of their conduct and behavior throughout their lives in the Mayan community. Therefore, the elected leader is the “father” of the community and is highly respected by the community (pg. 147, para. 1). From young to adulthood, the children are raised in the form that men are responsible to do the hard work as lead of the house and women are responsible do the work at home to feed the people in the house. They’re taught in the ways of playing games (pg. 154, para. 4). Their lives are culturally bound and each child must learn to respect the elders as well as be a generous being.
In Louise Erdrich’s “Making Babies”, she mainly spokes about her experience in her stages of pregnancy and how she felt the moments before and after her child was born. There was no such cultural ceremony as opposed to Menchu’s Mayan cultural revelation. Erdrich’s way of having a baby is westernized and modernized. She delivered her baby in the hospital like most modern pregnant women would do. In Mayan community it would rather be a scandal if any pregnant woman delivers her baby at hospital. They believe in natural birth and natural therapy. So, Erdrich’s depiction of “Making Babies” is almost the opposite of what Menchu’s “Birth Ceremonies” depicted. Erdrich talked about the stages of pregnancy and how she went through it mostly alone with her husband and the midwife. However, Menchu talked about how a pregnant woman’s baby is valued by the whole Mayan community and taken care of by the whole community. Both reflect the diverse cultural and lifestyle practices in different parts of the world. While Erdrich has no cultural pressure about the birth of babies, Menchu stated that Mayan babies have a lot of cultural responsibilities from the time they were born. It is most obvious that Erdrich’s modern lifestyle is revealed when she stated, “We snap photos, videotape, memorialize while we experience a fast-forward in which there is no replay of even a single instant” (pg. 103, para. 2). However, both Erdrich and Menchu have a common ground that giving birth to child is pain during labor and that women are strong and great in capable of bearing this pain.
Hi,Ms. Lee by contrasting the different lifestyle for each author "making Babies" & "Birth Ceremonies" that was very good in the sense that it makes it clear that both women were from different background. Menchu stressed how important Mayan babies are, by saying they have a lot of cultural responsibilities from the time they were born. which means that they have a lots of obligation at and early stage of there life.
We all have different points of views to every situation and “Making babies” and “Birth ceremonies” is an example of different points of views from women that experienced the same kind or very similar kind of labor and putting their views into writing so that every one can have an idea of what it actually feels like. In a short summary, Louise Erdrich emphasized more on the anguish, torture, suffering and pain women go through during the period she is pregnant and to top it up, after the nine months of carrying the child then she has to go through the labor (hoping everything is successful and nothing goes the other way around) if everything goes according to plan then she now has to take up the responsibility to breast feed the child and make sure the child keeps pace with the world. All of this is what Louise emphasized in her article of “Making babies.” According to Rigoberta Menchu, on the other hand, reality is a hard piece of cake and life is also a struggle to survive in, she also went ahead and compared life as weaving a Corte clothe with numerous threads. Cultural opportunities have helped in the sense that according to Rigoberta, when a woman is pregnant, she goes with her husband to the elected leaders that she is going to have a child, because the child will not only belong to them but to the whole community and that is a good concept because it helps to ease off the tension on the mother even though she is the one carrying the baby it still clears her mind to know that there are people that cares about her and her unborn child, but on the other hand it also have its own disadvantages. She also stated that later when she’s in her seventh month, the mother then introduces her baby to the natural world, as their customs tell her to. She goes out in the fields or walks over the hills. She also has to show her baby the kind of life she leads, so that if she gets up at three in the morning, does her chores and tends to animals, she does it all the more when she is pregnant, conscious that the child is taking all this in. In reality speaking, I wouldn’t really support that because the baby really cannot learn anything at that time but since custom says it helps baby in learning the way of life then I think it’s a very good thing. In conclusion, the mother-infant relationship between the two mothers in which cultural pressures have encouraged and agreed upon is that “WOMEN” play a very important role in the environment but the thing is that most people tend to ignore it. To cut the long story short, I think both articles are emphasizing on the importance that without women there are no babies and without babies, no future leaders. Hence, women’s effort should be appreciated even though the pressure from cultural believes have made them not to loose hope or give up but to be more stronger.
Hi, kadri, I must say that I agree with most of what you said. I would have like to hear what you thought were some of the disadvantages of the community raising the child. Further more I disagree with on thing that was said, that the baby cannot learn anything at this time. Scientist have found that babies can hear their mother's voice from their third trimester which is from 7-9 months the same time that the Mayans practice this. The thing is that scientist just discovered this. Something that the Mayans have been practicing for a long time. Laura Flynn Mccarthy, author of Parenting Magazine, states: "that The uterus isn't exactly the quietest place to hang out. Not only can a baby hear the sounds of his mom's body -- her stomach growling, her heart beating, the occasional hiccup or burp -- but he can also hear noises from beyond. If mom sits in a movie theater with state-of-the-art sound or walks by a noisy construction site, odds are the fetus will react to all the ruckus by kicking or shifting around. Perhaps the most significant sound that a baby hears in the utero is his mother's voice. Around the seventh and eighth month, a fetus's heart rate slows down slightly whenever his mother is speaking, indicating that mom's voice has a calming effect." "This could be that the maternal voice is communicated to the fetus in two ways: as ambient sound through the abdomen and internally through the vibration of vocal chords," says Janet DiPietro, Ph.D., a developmental psychologist at Johns Hopkins University. "In contrast, external voices and other noises are only heard as ambient sounds.
I also agree with almost all what you said. but just like Tennille, I disagree with what you said that a mother talking to her baby does not have any effect on a baby. I am a father and when my wife has been pregnant in about her eight month, I have spoken softly to the baby and I have seen how he responds by moving inside the womb.
There is an ancient African proverb that says, "It takes a whole village to raise a child". Rigoberta Menchus’s writing is very interesting and is very similar to this African proverb, practiced in many of the African communities. But Rigoberta is more about the spiritual traditions and rituals that are mandatory in her Quiche culture, since the future (both temporal & spiritual) well-being of the child depends on the strict observance of their customs. These traditions and customs are very sacred to the community, since it has helped them survived through generation. Also this unity that exists in the community is shown as everyone takes their responsibilities seriously and they are very strict in being their brother’s keeper. What I really enjoyed about Rigobertas writing, is how descriptive she is on giving detailed information about the step by step rituals that need to be followed but also how respectful she was at not giving away secrets that only belong to her culture and community.(Para. 5, Line 1-4). The Mayas are very religious persons and they respect nature. They believed that everything we do either protects and preserves nature and at the same time that is how nature will respond in providing for their needs. Their traditions have helped them be very industrious and hard working people. It is also very interesting to note how in the Quiche community women are treated with much respect for they have very important roles/responsibilities in the community and the family. But a very special or reverent respect is given to pregnant women. Girls and women are compared to mother earth, a giver of life. (pg 153 line 35-36) On the other hand I respect also Erdrich’s shared experience and all the difficulties women encounter with their emotional and physical health while being pregnant. The western culture is completely different from the Quiche Mayan but one thing in common is that every culture in the world has way of overcoming the fear of uncertainties and difficulties in life. The Quiche prepare the baby from the womb by doing rituals and by being united. The western culture also prepares a child from the womb, our women eat only healthy food and once a child is born, everything takes second place for our women; they become fearless in defending and teaching a child.
I like the analogy, in the beginning of your paragraph, of the African proverb tying it to Menchus’s writing in how the community is being depicted as village that raises a child. Also I agree with your response on Menchus’s emphasis being place on the Mayas traditions, and the fact that the girl and women were considered “givers of life”. I like the fact that you were able to capture the disparity between the western culture and the quiche Mayan and yet let us become aware that the cultures are overcomers of fear of uncertainties and difficulties in life. One thing, though, it would have been nice to have known more of your views on Louise Erdrich’s “Making Babies”.
In Louise Erdrich’s “Making Babies” and in Manchu’s “Birth Ceremonies” both look at the bringing of children into this world. In “Making Babies”, Erdrich focused on the giving birth process and especially emphasized the process that the mother experienced. The women were identified as contributors to the society and noted that they bodies became shaped to grew the child inside, it seem impossible engineer for birth– “making a ship inside a bottle” page 104 paragraph 1. The woman’s body changed losing shape and also experiencing pain. All encompassed the mystery of birth, the baby grew inside a woman’s womb. The mother wanted the baby to become normal and feared that her behavior would affect the outcome of how the baby turned out to be. Her hope was for a perfect baby. In “Birth Ceremonies” Manchu focused on the child being born into a culture where the entire community became a part of the rearing of the child; page 147 paragraph 1.This Mayan community maintains their culture and was evidently secretive. page 148 paragraph 3. There were the processes of what was required from the mother, the child’s role as male or female and the traditions were upheld as very important to its culture. The similarity comes from the aspect of the child’s birth into this world. Erdrich’s personal experiences are concentrated on the importance of the child in the process that the mother experiences through giving birth. On the other hand Manchu’s focused on the Mayan’s culture and tradition from what is done with the child in the womb of the mother to the upbringing of the child, the step by step cultural experiences.
From Rigoberta Menchu point of view based on their beliefs they have certain days where they consider it should be a good day and bad days based on their religious beliefs. In the presentation they stated that it is the environment that they live which is a contributing factor that causes a lot of death during birth and a lot of sicknesses. The indigenous people look at all the aspects of when bringing a child into the world due the conditions they live in. While “in Making Babies” Louise doesn’t look at all the conditions like how an indigenous person would look at it. Louise Looks at it as something joyful to her where as procreation comes in pg 106 line 3 shows this, where as to indigenous person view giving birth to a child is sacred. Both Rigoberta and Louise view are based on giving birth to a child only that Rigoberta focuses on tradition based on religion and Louise views are from the western hemisphere where the people of Belize can relate to it.
I Must Agree With Ruby, However as ones personal point of view yes different cultures have there different ways of believe when it comes to child bearing and procreation. In Louise point as Tyrone mentioned as well, article "Making Babies" it's more from just a motherly instinct , simply Joy, Happines and Caring . She doesnt go in debth unlike the other which goes in bedt of believes like certain days to start procreation in order to make a child in one favor, and believes on it's motherly childhood. At the end I'd have to agree with both , because while just sticking to ones point of view at the end of the day both has a feature of the other belief.
In both stories the authors view the mother-infant experience differently due to their cultures. In making babies, Louise Erdrich expresses the personal emotional experience, the joy, anguish, the abstract and complication, the strain and sacrifice of making babies, whilst in birth ceremonies, Rigoberta Menchu views the importance of the experience. In the western culture for Louise Erdrich, conception is viewed as a chance on page 102 line 4,an accident on page 105, line 5, whilst for the Mayans it is viewed as something to be celebrated. The western culture focuses on the personal emotional experience of the conception, the pregnancy, the birth and the rearing as something that is a powerful and mundane creative act that rapturously sucks up whole chunks of your life, page 102, line 10-11, and takes place in the blink of the eye(page 103, paragraph 2). Whilst the Mayan culture sees each phase as something to be celebrated and shared by the whole community. An opportunity to develop the child into a great person. The western culture allows the mother the opportunity to freely choose from all different options, how she would like to handle her child, pregnancy, labor and rearing. Whilst in the Mayan culture their are strict guidelines and less choices as seen on page 148, paragraph 2. Even though the cultures encourages contrasting arrangements they also share common ones. They both baptize their children and have godparents. Both culture see the parent as the important factor in carrying, nurturing and rearing the child. For the western civilization the biological mother and father are seen as the sole parents and takes on all the responsibilities, experiences and expenses. For the Mayan cultures the community is seen as a family with the leaders as the parents and the citizens as the children thus from the moment a woman conceives the leaders(parents), are told and the pregnancy is celebrated by the entire community as this pregnancy will add another member to the family. The birth of a new member is very significant for the community, as it belongs to the community, not just the parents (page 148, line 9-11). Both women takes care of their bodies and health to ensure that their infants are healthy. In both cultures the women work during their pregnancy. Both women has followed the culture passed down from their mothers. Both women see pregnancy physical and spiritual, Rigoberta sees it as more spiritual because of the culture she was brought up in. The bottom line is that both senarios are based on the culture, what is thought to you as being the right way of doing things is what you will perceive as being correct and acceptable.
Academic Journal #3, Blog #2 Rosendo Edgar Pacheco. Birth Ceremonies- Rigoberta Mench "It's as if the mother were a guide explaining things to a tourist." pg 147, ln 27-28 In Birth Ceremonies by Rigoberta Menchu, this sentence caught my attention almost immediately. Imagine, this author is comparing a mother to a tourist. But looking at it carefully this is a very good comparison. Let's analyze it a bit. Imagine yourself going to St. Hermans cave on the outskirts of Belmopan. It is your first visit and you forgot to book a guide. Upon standing on that big entrance, a new world to you, you become dumbfounded, you don't know where to go and it's pretty dark in there. But, if you had a guide, he could talk you through this darkness and you would be able to find your way. Well, the baby is also in a cave, all by himself and what the mother does is to speak to him, patting and rubbing the stomach, she is conveying very important messages to the child which will be quite instrumental in how he will operate when he finally exits this dark cave into the real world.
The Indian cultures have their own believe and practice that they should never abuse the nature world and it’s a must to have respect for the natural things the sun, moon, maize the beans the earth, they believed that The Sun is the Father and the Moon is the Mother, and their commitment is to maintain their customs and pass on the secret of their ancestors. For instant in “Birth Ceremony’ According to Rigoberta on the day a baby is conceived both parent of the child needs to consulted with their appointed leaders to have blessings approval of the baby. The child is not only for both parents but is now for the entire community, all ancestors are now a part of the child life and they will now work together as one to teach the child to follow as far as he can his ancestors tradition. The mother make bound with the baby and talk to the child about the natural world. According to Miss Menchu, “When a baby is seventh month, the mother introduces the baby to the natural world, as our customs to tell her to. show her baby the kinds of life she leads, so that if she get up at three in the morning does her chores and tends to the animals, she does it all the more so when she`s pregnant, conscious that the child is taking all this in” pg 147. The girls are taught that their job are to carry water and take care of the home and boys are to fetch horse and do the hard labor they have more responsibilities. In contrast with” Making Babies” Louise Endrich is basically saying that no matter what soreness and depression a woman goes through in order to bring forth a child in the end the ultimate reward is that of the baby and that making babies is a beautiful thing. She talks about the pain that a woman will have to endure in the process when a baby is conceived up to child’s birth. According to Louise Endrich “women are condemned to pain in child’s labor”. A pregnant woman is subject to stress, depression, some died during child labor, or have to do a c-section, but many have natural birth. However from the day the baby is conceived the mother developed an instant bond with the unborn child they often speech to the child and the love for that child is different of that of another adult. Just a look on the child`s face cease everything, erase all the pain the woman had endure in just a couple second everything had vanish. pg 106
Hi, everyone…my understanding of both stories is that each woman share piece of their own view and knowledge when giving birth to a child. This might just be one of their own experience and difficulties they encounter in live and yes, they might come from different cultures but the pain in bear a child or even losing a child might be the same. In “Making Babies” Louise Erdrich's gives a strong example of her culture while on “Birth Ceremonies” by Rigoberta's highlights that the cultural pressures that exist cause the focus to be more on the community’s relationship with the child. So sharing their personal experiences and observations regarding birth, they have similarities in both stories; still, there are several differences. For example, author Rigoberta Menchu speaks about sacred act when view a child…. You will note that in “Birth Ceremonies” there is a depiction to “Making Babies” of just how strong women are. Page 148, paragraph 2, when Menchu speaks about how her mother hang a rope from the roof and pulled her pregnant sister up and her sister gave birth in that position. This speaks true of just how strong a woman is. A woman has to be extremely strong to give birth while hanging from a roof... this is also showing that the Mayan cultures are warrior they endure pain from as early, ensure that they culture remain as his. Also On page 151, line 17, Menchu said “To us, suffering is our fate, and the child must be introduced to the sorrows and hardship, but he must learn that despite his suffering, he will be respectful and live through his pain.”… This statement was well said by “Rigoberta”….as mention by author the parents in Menchú’s writing are sad that they have brought a child into the world to suffer (p. 151); on the other hand, this thought seems to be absent when Erdrich gives birth. It is more reasonable to say that Erdrich chooses to elaborate on the grief and distress the mother endures rather than the potential difficulties the child will face later on in life. Contrasting what “Rigoberta” said to “Louise Erdrich” emphasized more on the anguish, and pain women go through during the period she is pregnant, after the nine months of carrying the child then she has to go through the labor hoping everything is successful, if everything goes according to plan then she now has to take up the responsibility in taking care of a child and make sure the child keeps pace with the world. By this she is bring up a strong point in which we as parent need to share our own experience with our childrens letting them know how important they are for their mother which endure the pain of agony they go through. Erdrich’s personal experiences are concentrated on the importance of the child in the process. Manchu’s focused on the Mayan’s culture tradition from what is done with the child in during pregnancy step by step from the bringing till the end of the 9 months of agony. For instance, there is a contrast between the preparations that are made during pregnancy to welcome the child into the world. On page 147 of “Birth Ceremonies” audience are informed that the mother tells the child how hard life is and apparently acknowledges negative forces that are present. In contrast, “Making Babies” has a more optimistic point of view about life. The parents in Menchú’s writing are sad that they have brought a child into the world to suffer (p. 151); on the other hand, this thought seems to be absent when Erdrich gives birth. Another comparison is that according to Miss Menchu, “When a baby is seventh month, the mother introduces the baby to the natural world, as our customs to tell her to.
Academic Journal #3, blog #2, Birth Ceremonies “As it belongs to the community” page 148 line 9-15. This line is interesting because other cultures besides, the Indian culture has this belief of a child belonging to a village not just the parents. Decades ago even in Belize; a child would be raised by neighbors’, family friends etc. Everyone in the community would have the right and responsibility of raising and disciplining a child. These days it’s very different in modern cultures because children are only raised by their parents, and the majority of the time the parents can’t spend quality time with their children because they are working. The story Birth Ceremonies by Rigoberta states that when a child is born in the Indian community, several members of that community must be present to receive the baby. Three couples should be at the child’s birth, and theses three couples should be specific people such as the village leader, the husbands father etc. The Indian culture emphasizes that the birth of a new member to their community is significant, and that the child is a result of communal love.
Britany Thompson: Part II “Protection of Fundamental Rights and Freedoms.” My two topics that I have chosen to explain about fundamental rights and freedom and are as follows:
Fundamental Rights and Freedom: Fundamental Rights and Freedom basically entails an individual right to say, whatever his race, place of origin, political opinions, colour, creed or sex, but subject to respect for the rights and freedoms of others and for the public interest, to each and all of the following: For instance, life, liberty, security of the person, and the protection of the law; freedom of conscience, of expression and of assembly and association; protection for his family life, his personal privacy, the privacy of his home and other property and recognition of his human dignity; lastly, protection from arbitrary deprivation of property. Every citizens, of this nation has the outmost fundamental rights of all of the following mention above, being that they are law abiding citizens. The reason is because they are born Belizean, and wants to feel protected, have the freedom to voice their opinions; and distress if the GOB fails to gives them their services; that they have promised the public. For example the public unions of this nation, like the teachers and union members have protested against the Government; wanted an adjustment for an salary increase for over 10 years. This clearly shows the fundamental rights and freedom being expressed by the teachers nation wide. In the sense that they have not been deprived of their civil rights of expression.
Finally, the fundamental rights and freedom further states according to research; that a person shall not be deprived of his life intentionally save in execution of the sentence of a court in respect of a criminal offence under any law of which he has been convicted. This basically mean that if a person is not guilty of an criminal offence he or she has the fundamental right to defend themselves, and should have the liberty to express themselves.
Protection of Freedom of Movement:
Protection of freedom of movement basically entails the right to move freely within one's own country.Everyone has the right to freedom of movement and residence within the borders of each State. Also everyone has the right to leave any country, including his own, and return to his country.The reason is because there have been numerous cases whereby imigrants of another country cannot leave their country to migrate to another country.
In addition, the right to free movement, or the denial of it, within national and international borders can have profound effects upon other basic human rights. Without the right to leave ones home, an individual may be politically repressed, prevented from observing his or her chosen religion, prevented from enjoying the basic right to marriage or family life, or blocked from a job or an education; that ultimately could enhance that individual's quality of life. Moreover; while free movement may seem on the surface to be a fairly minor and obvious human right; it actually is one of the most basic rights that in many nations around the world, when violated, causes numerous problems and cases of suffering. Hence the reason we as Belizeans has the fundamental right of liberty to migrate to another country without any difficulty. For this we are being bless so we should feel proud to move freely within our country whether regional or international.
In Louise Erdrich's "Making Babies" we see an explanation of a westerner's point of view as opposed to Rigoberta's "Birth Ceremonies", an indigenous person. This difference is accounted for mainly because of the difference in culture of these two women.
ReplyDeleteLouise Erdrich begins her story in line 1 saying, "We concieve our children in deepest night, in blazing sun, outdoors, in barns and alleys and minivans." For Louise, making babies is not seen from a serious, religious or ritualistic point of view.
Rigoberta on the other hand carries us through step by step how serious a birth is to these indigenous people. Rigoberta makes it very plain to us on page 148, line 10-11, that a child belongs to the whole community. Everyone in the community has a role to play from during the pregnancy stage up to whebn the child becomes an elder. Each stage of the child's life also has ceremonies, rituals that they go through. A child's life is constantly being guided by either the mother, the father or some other adult. As lines1-10 on page 155 tells us that the children are taught the ways of their ancestors and the must live their life as such.
It is also visible that the boy child is a bit more prized than the girl child in that apparently he will have more responsibilities than the girl. This is seen in lines 14-24 on page 153.
Rosendo Edgar Pacheco
I totally agree with you Rosendo. In making babies, the author didn't really demonstrate any seriousness or bliss of having a child. While in Birth Ceremonies, one get a true sense of how sacred the birth of a child is, at least for the indigenous people. This is noted by the author explaining the rituals and the lives of the women who are pregnant and the way that they are treated. Also the treatment of the baby; the baby is well loved and taken care of from the womb until he is born and grown, not only by the parents but by the entire community.
DeleteI agree with Edgar when he says that the Indian people raise a child as a community rather than individually or as just a family, because in the modernized world or westernized as Edgar stated parents consider it their sole duty to raise their child, no one outside the family has that level of responsibility for the child, I think this is so because in small communities like that of the Indians it is easier to trust people with your children.
DeleteWell I think Louise Erdrich in "Making babies" is only concerned about the rewards or women having the child and is less concerned about the seriousness of what continues after the child is being given birth to, so is like looking at the prenatal development and care and doesn't really care about the postnatal aspect unlike rigoberta.
DeleteI agree with this. In making babies Louise Erdrich is basically focused on the personal experience, the joy, the anguish and the sacrifice made in making a baby. Whilst Rigoberta Menchu, in birth ceremonies, explains the importance of the child and the privilege given to birthing and rearing an baby into an individual fit for the success of the community's future.
DeleteI concur with Edgar that In making babies Louise Erdrich speaks about her peronal experience, what an individual goes through when they are pregnant and all the suffering and pain that one has to endure.And in terms of Birth Ceremonies Rigoberto talks about a child being dor the entire community and not only for the parents.The community is now being involve in the childs life
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DeleteI personal agree with what edgar is saying for both "making Babies" & "Birth Ceremonies", but at the same time both authors are sharing personal experience. However, I’ve noticed similarities between the two stories; both women are mothers, giving each their own standpoint on childbearing. Although both mothers are from different backgrounds, they both view women as strong individuals.
DeleteHello people, why is there a delay in blogging? Remember you need to get a gmail account in order to access this system
ReplyDeleteIn both stories the authors view the mother-infant experience differently due to their culture. In making babies, Louise Enrich expresses the personal emotional experience whilst in birth ceremonies Rogoberta Menchu views the importance of the experience. In the western culture for Louise Enrich, conception is viewed as a chance, whilst for the Mayans it is viewed as something important to be celebrated. The western culture focuses on the personal emotional experience of the conception, the pregnancy, the birth and the rearing as something that takes place in the blink of the eye. Whilst the Mayan culture sees each phase as something to be celebrated and an opportunity to develop the child into a great member of their community. The western culture allows the mother the opportunity to freely choose from all different options, to handle her child, pregnancy, labor and rearing. Whilst in the Mayan culture their are strict guidelines and less choices.
DeleteBoth culture see the parent as the important factor in carrying, nurturing and rearing the child. For the western civilization the biological mother and father takes all responsibilities, experiences and expenses. For the Mayan cultures the community is seen as a family with the leaders as the parents and the citizens as the children thus from the moment a woman conceives the leaders(parents), are told and the pregnancy is celebrated by the entire community as this pregnant will add another member to the family. Both women has followed the culture passed down from their mothers. Both women see pregnancy physical and spiritual, Rigoberta sees it as more spiritual because of the culture she was brought up in. Both senarios are based on the culture of the area and thus is seen as the right thing to be done.
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ReplyDeleteIn “Making Babies”, Louise Erdrich expresses herself from a westerner’s point of view. Erdrich speaks about how child birth is looked at today in the western part of the world. She discusses the pain and suffering that a woman goes through when giving birth to a child. She talks about the different phases a woman go through when she is pregnant such as, always eating, the cravings, sleeping, the weight gain and the actual act of giving birth “labor.”
ReplyDeleteOn page 104, 2nd paragraph Erdrich mentioned “It is a true pain one is attempting to endure in drugless labor, not “discomfort,” and the way to deal with pain is not to call it something else but to increase in strength, to prepare the will. Women are strong, strong, terrible strong. We don’t know how strong we are until we’re pushing out our babies.” For the most part, Erdrich focuses more on the depressing aspect of child birth (the pain and the changes a woman body goes through) and not of the bliss that women experiences when giving birth and after.
Rigoberta Menchu on the other hand in “Birth Ceremonies” views child birth as a sacred act. Her Maya culture, which is very different from the westerner’s, view childbirth as a blessing and doesn’t put too much emphasis on the pain and difficulty of giving birth. You will note that in “Birth Ceremonies” there is a depiction to “Making Babies” of just how strong women are. Page 148, paragraph 2, when Menchu speaks about how her mother hang a rope from the roof and pulled her pregnant sister up and her sister gave birth in that position. This speaks true of just how strong a woman is. A woman has to be extremely strong to give birth while hanging from a roof. However; the difference is, they embrace that pain and teach their children from a very young age embrace it too.
On page 151, line 19, Menchu said “To us, suffering is our fate, and the child must be introduced to the sorrows and hardship, but he must learn that despite his suffering, he will be respectful and live through his pain.” This is something that they have accepted. The children in the western part of the world are rarely brought up with these values. It is also noted on page 148, line 9, when a child is born, it is very significant to the community as it belongs to the community. The community assists in raising that child. Once upon a time, it was the same in the western world, now it is everyone for themselves, everyone wanting to do their own thing. It simply boils down to traditions and keeping true to your culture. For many the customs and values are lost.
Althea Sebastian
Hi Althea,
DeleteQuite interesting piece of work. I just want to disagree slightly with you on a point that you made. In your observations you stated,"and not the bliss that women experience when giving birth and after." Why do I disagree with this part statement? Well, even from Erdrich's point of view, after all the pain and suffering, the end result is that, a baby, god's greatest gift to a woman. As Erdrich comments on line 14-15 page 112, "for even though it wants at times to lie down and quit, the body(female body) is an honest hardworking marvel that gives everything to this one task...(That of giving birth.
Rosendo Edgar Pacheco with my five cents.
I agree with you when you say that Louise focuses on the depressing part about child labor, but Menchu also gives a sense of sadness because Indians consider the suffering that they are bringing the child into and they feel saddened by this thought.
DeleteThis is true that we have lost a sense of community and belongingness, especially in Belize. I have always admired the Cayo community, they are always united, they celebrate festivals together, they celebrate religious ceremonies together, and as seen recently they stand strong together against crime. I think it is a good practice for the rest of the country to pick back up.
DeleteI appreciated that you noted that the Quiche Maya group teach their children to embrace pain and build their endurance and perseverance. I see this as a good idea to adopt since it is realistic and might make a person feel like less of a victim or helpless when unfavorable situations arise. Page 151 states they share about "the suffering of the family". Even though they are talking about suffering, this statement still provides reassurance that they are not alone and it promotes unity.
DeleteIn Rigoberta Mencu’s depiction of mother infant relationship you see a much deeper bound with mothers of Maya decent even from the first weeks of pregnancy these mothers speak to their developing fetuses, they explain to their babies their way of life, they are basically trying to instill in them norms, mores, and cultural values before they child is even born. A clear contrasting view of this can be seen when you Compare “Birth Ceremonies” to “Making babies” the mother in making babies complains about being treated like babies themselves, in the modern Americanized societies pregnant woman are seen as delicate and weak and as such they should not be exposed to hard labor while pregnant, this is stated on page 104 line 26-27. But on the other hand in the Indian community women continue to work hard when pregnant they say this is to get the baby accustomed to the life of hard work that it will be born into this is also stated on page 149 line 37-39.
ReplyDeleteIn the modernized world, cultural norms state that women who have just given birth can allow anyone to view the baby almost immediately after delivery, but in the Indian community the mother and child most spend 8 days alone, this is a bounding period between mother and child where not even her other children can see the child beforehand this is a cultural pressure that states that mother be alone with her offspring. In addition other cultural pressures include the Indian mother having the child outside of a hospital this is considered the norm for them to berth a child, while on the other hand in the developed world it is considered a must and a matter of safety to have a child in a hospital because of complications that might occur during labor.
The Indians do share a common trait with modernized people which are to baptize the baby. Another sharp contrast between the two is that the Indians believe that the child belongs to the community it learns the traditions ceremonies, responsibilities, Morales etc from the community, while in the modernized world parents believe they or just the family is responsible for the child, and teaching it right from wrong. Also the Indians bounds the babies hands which seems to be a bit ruff while in making babies the treat the baby with care.
Another example of cultural pressure would be the mood that is set at the time of birth, in the Indian society there is a feeling of sorrow because they believe they are bringing the baby into a world of suffering, while on the other hand modernized parents have a feeling of happiness when a baby is born.
In terms of opportunities that influence both these societies, in the Indian society they seem to encourage poverty or living a simple life, they encourage their children not be corrupted by worldly positions, and in the modernized world or the making babies story the mother looks forward to their child’s accomplishments finishing school, having a successful life which is the complete opposite of what the Indians want.
I agree with what you're saying about the similarities of both the Maya and the modern societies wanting to teach the child morals and values, as do all parents want the best for their children. However, you mentioned that the Maya encourage poverty, I would have to disagree with you there.
DeleteThe Maya own their land, they work the land and live off of it. They have food to eat, food that they've grown themselves, they just choose to consume little of it. They make their own clothing and their children are educated based on their own teachings, and to them grow to have enough wisdom to lead the community.
They are not impoverished people nor do they live 'a simple life' because they are hard-working people- as Menchu stated even through pregnancy the women are working hard, and they too have sorrow and trial times.
when compared to modern societies, they do seem a little 'unsophisticated' and 'savage-like' in their choice of living,but is it because we do not understand why they choose to live that way? After all their reasons for doing certain practices are a secret.
I have to AGREE to Shauniece Heusner that Mayans don't encourage poverty. In contrast, they are mostly hard working peasants who eat what they have grown. This is sustainability of life. And I totally admires and respect that.
DeleteAfter seeing the videos Mr. Tucker posted here, Menchu had mentioned about the savage reality of modernized world and bubbling wealth. There are people in different world consuming different amount of water per day. Some people over-consumed them, and some under-consumed them.
This phenomena let us know that indeed modernized society are abundant with everything we want and need. However, people nowadays abuse it and waste it so much that the earth is now suffering imbalance. One example everyone should know is Global Warming. It is caused by modernized lifestyles and high-technology.
Hi Robert,
DeleteI enjoyed reading your review. I agree with you for the most part, but I just want to add a few observations of my own.
According to Menchu, the maya bring the child into a world of suffering and that is why from the moment that baby is concieved the maya women are there talking to the fetus, guiding it through, teaching them their cultures etc, so that when that baby is born it will be equipped to deal with their way of life.
As for Erdrich, maybe western women don't really do a lot of teaching or guiding to their fetus but they do talk to their fetus. Pregnant women are extremely careful as to what they eat, how much they eat etc, all because they want a healthy child to be born who will be able to withstand the forces of nature in the real world. Pacheco here with my five cents.
Rigoberta Menchu’s “Birth Ceremonies” depicts the traditions and beliefs of pregnancy and birth from an indigenous Quiche Maya of Guatemala’s perspective. These traditions and beliefs were held secret to the Quiche Maya, for fear that anyone on the outside could use them against the Maya people. “Learn to protect yourselves by keeping our secret”- Popul Vuh. The Quiche Maya take their teachings quite serious and so her entire chapter is based on the ceremonies carried out by the Quiche Maya to celebrate the coming of a new child to their community. Some of these traditions are to teach the unborn infant the way of life from inside the womb. A Quiche Maya’s life is hard and so they must learn of hard work before being born- as the mother will continue her hard day’s labour throughout the pregnancy. During childbirth, the placenta is burned and not buried to respect the earth and when the child is born they are taught to respect the earth also.
ReplyDeleteLouise Erdrich’s “Making Babies” starts out with her saying “We have no rules, no ceremonies, we don't even need a driver's license”, meaning that when it comes to conception and birth, the modern society foregoes any traditions or beliefs. This is completely opposite of what Menchu describes in her chapter. Instead of highlighting traditions, she highlights the emotions of a mother during her pregnancy. The morning sickness, the cravings, the hormones. Even during birth, she speaks on the pain that the mother feels, the decision to have surgery or medication based on emotions again. When the child is born, Erdrich once again highlights the joy and pleasure of the child to the mother.
However, I’ve noticed similarities between the two stories, both women reminisce of their mothers’ standpoint on childbirth. Both mothers, although coming from two completely different backgrounds, hold women as strong individuals Menchu’s mother encourages her daughter to give birth in an upright position, and Erdrich’s mother encourages her daughter to have a natural birth with no medication. Another similarity is that both women speak of the mother’s in the story as people who love and want to nurture their unborn child. Erdrich speaks about quitting the unhealthy habits such as smoking and incorporating a more balanced and healthy diet to develop a strong healthy child. Menchu speaks about the mothers eating the leaves that contain vitamins, and taking the baths “infused with evergreens” to help relax the mother so that the child is not harmed after a long day of work. Also, both women speak about the child becoming a part of a bigger whole. Menchu speaks of the child becoming a part of the community and Erdrich speaks of the child becoming a part of the family.
Because of the cultural teachings’ strong influence on the Maya, they view birth as a fulfillment of life and a growth and inclusion of their tight-knitted society. The birth of a child means that they as a people have become stronger and thus their wisdoms, principles and beliefs become stronger. The birth of a child today in the modern societies, according to Erdrich, means that there is also fulfillment at the end, however; this is the fulfillment of a mother and the unforgettable experience she most go through to receive the pleasure of bringing a child of her own into the world.
I really enjoyed the contrast you made between the end of your first paragraph and the beginning of the second. If we were to answer the question in one sentence, those lines would probably be the best to go about doing so. Menchu stressed how important respecting the Earth and nature is to her culture and she elaborated on doing things according to tradition. On the other hand, Erdrich's writing certainly didn't began by proposing that things in her environment are done or should be done in a planned, specific or detailed order.
DeleteI like the way you give the clear comparisons about the "Birth Ceremonies" and "Making Babies". There are some similarities that I may have overlooked.
DeleteBased on your paragraph, I would conclude that a contrast is that Mayan culture about baby birth and growth are based on a community family point of view while Erdrich's modernized way of baby birth and growth are based on more personal point of view. One similarity is that both signified women as strong when giving birth and that babies must received health care during pregnancy.
I really like the step by step details of similarity between the two stories. I do agree that the Quiche Maya take their culture very seriously and also the way how you noted that the “entire chapter is based on the ceremonies carried out by the Quiche Maya to celebrate the coming of a new child to their community”. What caught my attention is the identification that Menchu highlighted traditions whereas Erdrich highlighted the emotions of a mother during her pregnancy.
Delete“Making Babies” and “Birth Ceremonies” are both written by women who are sharing their personal experiences and observations regarding birth. Similarities are noticeable in both excerpts; still, there are several differences. For instance, there is a contrast between the preparations that are made during pregnancy to welcome the child into the world. On page 147 of “Birth Ceremonies” readers are informed that the mother tells the child how hard life is and apparently acknowledges negative forces that are present (para. 2). In contrast, “Making Babies” has a more optimistic point of view about life itself once the baby has been born. The parents in Menchú’s writing are sad that they have brought a child into the world to suffer (p. 151); on the other hand, this thought seems to be absent when Erdrich gives birth. It is more reasonable to say that Erdrich chooses to elaborate on the suffering and discomfort the mother endures rather than the potential difficulties the child will face later on in life. Also, the children are more aware and informed about exactly when there is a birth in “Making Babies”. Conversely, in “Birth Ceremonies” only the parents know about the baby’s birth (p. 149). The baby is integrated slowly into Quiché families compared to other cultures since “the newborn baby should be alone with his mother in a special place for eight days” (p. 150).Greater emphasis is also placed on the individuals who are present at the time of birth in indigenous communities. Compared to the mother-infant relationship in “Making Babies”, mothers in Maya families are much more detailed when it comes to explaining the significance of their actions to their children and what their responsibilities are because of the complex symbolism that is an element of their culture.
ReplyDeleteClearly, “Birth Ceremony” highlights that the cultural pressures that exist cause the focus to be more on the community’s relationship with the child and not just the mother-infant relationship. Perhaps some of these customs like hiding a baby’s birth stem from their Sacred book in which they are advised not to share unnecessary information with people who do not belong to their community. Hence, the opportunities that others had of influencing them caused them to feel that they could protect themselves through secrecy and by imitating their ancestors.
Hi Karina, I enjoyed reading your comparisons based on two diverse cultural practices of baby birth.
DeleteI would like to add some more points to your view.
Menchu emphasize mostly about a child's growth when he/she was born while Erdrich emphasize mostly about a child's formation in mother's womb. Therefore, Menchu depicted ceremonies of a child from when he's born until when he's a grown up person. On the other hand, Erdrich depicted the stages of pregnancy and what she experiences during the process of pregnancy.
I would say I kind of like Quiche's way of teaching their kids to become an honest and respectable being since birth.
Also, Erdrich's detailed explanation about stages of pregnancy makes me aware of things I've never experienced.
Menchu’s depiction of “Birth Ceremony” as opposed to Erdrich’s “Making Babies” both are talking about the importance of a child’s birth. However, the extremely varied cultures and lifestyles foster children in different ways.
ReplyDeleteRigoberta Menchu Tum, the author of “Birth Ceremonies”, is a Mayan of Guatemala’s Quiche group. In her narrative, the child must go through many cultural ceremonies before and after he/she was born. For an instance, mother must guide and talk to the baby in the belly about the life he/she will live in and what sufferings he/she will endure like how the mother and the ancestors did (pg. 147, para.2). Mayan believes in Sun, Moon, and God as well as respects beans, maize, plants, and earth. They believe that all the generations must follow the exact footsteps of their ancestors with obliged to the community. Menchu stated that ceremonies for birth for male and female may be slightly different since males carry more responsibilities when they’re born. Males are given extra day alone with his mother when he’s born as opposed to usual 8 days alone. He also gets more food than usual custom of killing a sheep or some chickens. However, females are equally important as they carry different responsibilities such as multiply the life of their generation (pg. 153, para. 3). Mayan children are said to belong to the community and not merely their parents. They are born to serve the community and pass their secret cultures down as well as to avoid any intruder. Their elected leader is responsible of their conduct and behavior throughout their lives in the Mayan community. Therefore, the elected leader is the “father” of the community and is highly respected by the community (pg. 147, para. 1). From young to adulthood, the children are raised in the form that men are responsible to do the hard work as lead of the house and women are responsible do the work at home to feed the people in the house. They’re taught in the ways of playing games (pg. 154, para. 4). Their lives are culturally bound and each child must learn to respect the elders as well as be a generous being.
In Louise Erdrich’s “Making Babies”, she mainly spokes about her experience in her stages of pregnancy and how she felt the moments before and after her child was born. There was no such cultural ceremony as opposed to Menchu’s Mayan cultural revelation. Erdrich’s way of having a baby is westernized and modernized. She delivered her baby in the hospital like most modern pregnant women would do. In Mayan community it would rather be a scandal if any pregnant woman delivers her baby at hospital. They believe in natural birth and natural therapy. So, Erdrich’s depiction of “Making Babies” is almost the opposite of what Menchu’s “Birth Ceremonies” depicted. Erdrich talked about the stages of pregnancy and how she went through it mostly alone with her husband and the midwife. However, Menchu talked about how a pregnant woman’s baby is valued by the whole Mayan community and taken care of by the whole community. Both reflect the diverse cultural and lifestyle practices in different parts of the world. While Erdrich has no cultural pressure about the birth of babies, Menchu stated that Mayan babies have a lot of cultural responsibilities from the time they were born. It is most obvious that Erdrich’s modern lifestyle is revealed when she stated, “We snap photos, videotape, memorialize while we experience a fast-forward in which there is no replay of even a single instant” (pg. 103, para. 2). However, both Erdrich and Menchu have a common ground that giving birth to child is pain during labor and that women are strong and great in capable of bearing this pain.
well said Berly.
DeleteHi,Ms. Lee by contrasting the different lifestyle for each author "making Babies" & "Birth Ceremonies" that was very good in the sense that it makes it clear that both women were from different background. Menchu stressed how important Mayan babies are, by saying they have a lot of cultural responsibilities from the time they were born. which means that they have a lots of obligation at and early stage of there life.
DeleteWe all have different points of views to every situation and “Making babies” and “Birth ceremonies” is an example of different points of views from women that experienced the same kind or very similar kind of labor and putting their views into writing so that every one can have an idea of what it actually feels like. In a short summary, Louise Erdrich emphasized more on the anguish, torture, suffering and pain women go through during the period she is pregnant and to top it up, after the nine months of carrying the child then she has to go through the labor (hoping everything is successful and nothing goes the other way around) if everything goes according to plan then she now has to take up the responsibility to breast feed the child and make sure the child keeps pace with the world. All of this is what Louise emphasized in her article of “Making babies.” According to Rigoberta Menchu, on the other hand, reality is a hard piece of cake and life is also a struggle to survive in, she also went ahead and compared life as weaving a Corte clothe with numerous threads. Cultural opportunities have helped in the sense that according to Rigoberta, when a woman is pregnant, she goes with her husband to the elected leaders that she is going to have a child, because the child will not only belong to them but to the whole community and that is a good concept because it helps to ease off the tension on the mother even though she is the one carrying the baby it still clears her mind to know that there are people that cares about her and her unborn child, but on the other hand it also have its own disadvantages. She also stated that later when she’s in her seventh month, the mother then introduces her baby to the natural world, as their customs tell her to. She goes out in the fields or walks over the hills. She also has to show her baby the kind of life she leads, so that if she gets up at three in the morning, does her chores and tends to animals, she does it all the more when she is pregnant, conscious that the child is taking all this in. In reality speaking, I wouldn’t really support that because the baby really cannot learn anything at that time but since custom says it helps baby in learning the way of life then I think it’s a very good thing. In conclusion, the mother-infant relationship between the two mothers in which cultural pressures have encouraged and agreed upon is that “WOMEN” play a very important role in the environment but the thing is that most people tend to ignore it. To cut the long story short, I think both articles are emphasizing on the importance that without women there are no babies and without babies, no future leaders. Hence, women’s effort should be appreciated even though the pressure from cultural believes have made them not to loose hope or give up but to be more stronger.
ReplyDeleteHi, kadri,
DeleteI must say that I agree with most of what you said. I would have like to hear what you thought were some of the disadvantages of the community raising the child. Further more I disagree with on thing that was said, that the baby cannot learn anything at this time. Scientist have found that babies can hear their mother's voice from their third trimester which is from 7-9 months the same time that the Mayans practice this. The thing is that scientist just discovered this. Something that the Mayans have been practicing for a long time. Laura Flynn Mccarthy, author of Parenting Magazine, states: "that The uterus isn't exactly the quietest place to hang out. Not only can a baby hear the sounds of his mom's body -- her stomach growling, her heart beating, the occasional hiccup or burp -- but he can also hear noises from beyond. If mom sits in a movie theater with state-of-the-art sound or walks by a noisy construction site, odds are the fetus will react to all the ruckus by kicking or shifting around. Perhaps the most significant sound that a baby hears in the utero is his mother's voice. Around the seventh and eighth month, a fetus's heart rate slows down slightly whenever his mother is speaking, indicating that mom's voice has a calming effect."
"This could be that the maternal voice is communicated to the fetus in two ways: as ambient sound through the abdomen and internally through the vibration of vocal chords," says Janet DiPietro, Ph.D., a developmental psychologist at Johns Hopkins University. "In contrast, external voices and other noises are only heard as ambient sounds.
I also agree with almost all what you said. but just like Tennille, I disagree with what you said that a mother talking to her baby does not have any effect on a baby. I am a father and when my wife has been pregnant in about her eight month, I have spoken softly to the baby and I have seen how he responds by moving inside the womb.
DeleteThere is an ancient African proverb that says, "It takes a whole village to raise a child". Rigoberta Menchus’s writing is very interesting and is very similar to this African proverb, practiced in many of the African communities. But Rigoberta is more about the spiritual traditions and rituals that are mandatory in her Quiche culture, since the future (both temporal & spiritual) well-being of the child depends on the strict observance of their customs. These traditions and customs are very sacred to the community, since it has helped them survived through generation. Also this unity that exists in the community is shown as everyone takes their responsibilities seriously and they are very strict in being their brother’s keeper.
ReplyDeleteWhat I really enjoyed about Rigobertas writing, is how descriptive she is on giving detailed information about the step by step rituals that need to be followed but also how respectful she was at not giving away secrets that only belong to her culture and community.(Para. 5, Line 1-4).
The Mayas are very religious persons and they respect nature. They believed that everything we do either protects and preserves nature and at the same time that is how nature will respond in providing for their needs. Their traditions have helped them be very industrious and hard working people.
It is also very interesting to note how in the Quiche community women are treated with much respect for they have very important roles/responsibilities in the community and the family. But a very special or reverent respect is given to pregnant women. Girls and women are compared to mother earth, a giver of life. (pg 153 line 35-36)
On the other hand I respect also Erdrich’s shared experience and all the difficulties women encounter with their emotional and physical health while being pregnant.
The western culture is completely different from the Quiche Mayan but one thing in common is that every culture in the world has way of overcoming the fear of uncertainties and difficulties in life. The Quiche prepare the baby from the womb by doing rituals and by being united. The western culture also prepares a child from the womb, our women eat only healthy food and once a child is born, everything takes second place for our women; they become fearless in defending and teaching a child.
I like the analogy, in the beginning of your paragraph, of the African proverb tying it to Menchus’s writing in how the community is being depicted as village that raises a child. Also I agree with your response on Menchus’s emphasis being place on the Mayas traditions, and the fact that the girl and women were considered “givers of life”. I like the fact that you were able to capture the disparity between the western culture and the quiche Mayan and yet let us become aware that the cultures are overcomers of fear of uncertainties and difficulties in life. One thing, though, it would have been nice to have known more of your views on Louise Erdrich’s “Making Babies”.
DeleteIn Louise Erdrich’s “Making Babies” and in Manchu’s “Birth Ceremonies” both look at the bringing of children into this world. In “Making Babies”, Erdrich focused on the giving birth process and especially emphasized the process that the mother experienced. The women were identified as contributors to the society and noted that they bodies became shaped to grew the child inside, it seem impossible engineer for birth– “making a ship inside a bottle” page 104 paragraph 1. The woman’s body changed losing shape and also experiencing pain. All encompassed the mystery of birth, the baby grew inside a woman’s womb. The mother wanted the baby to become normal and feared that her behavior would affect the outcome of how the baby turned out to be. Her hope was for a perfect baby. In “Birth Ceremonies” Manchu focused on the child being born into a culture where the entire community became a part of the rearing of the child; page 147 paragraph 1.This Mayan community maintains their culture and was evidently secretive. page 148 paragraph 3. There were the processes of what was required from the mother, the child’s role as male or female and the traditions were upheld as very important to its culture.
ReplyDeleteThe similarity comes from the aspect of the child’s birth into this world. Erdrich’s personal experiences are concentrated on the importance of the child in the process that the mother experiences through giving birth. On the other hand Manchu’s focused on the Mayan’s culture and tradition from what is done with the child in the womb of the mother to the upbringing of the child, the step by step cultural experiences.
From Rigoberta Menchu point of view based on their beliefs they have certain days where they consider it should be a good day and bad days based on their religious beliefs. In the presentation they stated that it is the environment that they live which is a contributing factor that causes a lot of death during birth and a lot of sicknesses. The indigenous people look at all the aspects of when bringing a child into the world due the conditions they live in. While “in Making Babies” Louise doesn’t look at all the conditions like how an indigenous person would look at it. Louise Looks at it as something joyful to her where as procreation comes in pg 106 line 3 shows this, where as to indigenous person view giving birth to a child is sacred. Both Rigoberta and Louise view are based on giving birth to a child only that Rigoberta focuses on tradition based on religion and Louise views are from the western hemisphere where the people of Belize can relate to it.
ReplyDeleteI Must Agree With Ruby, However as ones personal point of view yes different cultures have there different ways of believe when it comes to child bearing and procreation. In Louise point as Tyrone mentioned as well, article "Making Babies" it's more from just a motherly instinct , simply Joy, Happines and Caring . She doesnt go in debth unlike the other which goes in bedt of believes like certain days to start procreation in order to make a child in one favor, and believes on it's motherly childhood. At the end I'd have to agree with both , because while just sticking to ones point of view at the end of the day both has a feature of the other belief.
ReplyDeleteIn both stories the authors view the mother-infant experience differently due to their cultures. In making babies, Louise Erdrich expresses the personal emotional experience, the joy, anguish, the abstract and complication, the strain and sacrifice of making babies, whilst in birth ceremonies, Rigoberta Menchu views the importance of the experience. In the western culture for Louise Erdrich, conception is viewed as a chance on page 102 line 4,an accident on page 105, line 5, whilst for the Mayans it is viewed as something to be celebrated. The western culture focuses on the personal emotional experience of the conception, the pregnancy, the birth and the rearing as something that is a powerful and mundane creative act that rapturously sucks up whole chunks of your life, page 102, line 10-11, and takes place in the blink of the eye(page 103, paragraph 2). Whilst the Mayan culture sees each phase as something to be celebrated and shared by the whole community. An opportunity to develop the child into a great person. The western culture allows the mother the opportunity to freely choose from all different options, how she would like to handle her child, pregnancy, labor and rearing. Whilst in the Mayan culture their are strict guidelines and less choices as seen on page 148, paragraph 2.
ReplyDeleteEven though the cultures encourages contrasting arrangements they also share common ones. They both baptize their children and have godparents. Both culture see the parent as the important factor in carrying, nurturing and rearing the child. For the western civilization the biological mother and father are seen as the sole parents and takes on all the responsibilities, experiences and expenses. For the Mayan cultures the community is seen as a family with the leaders as the parents and the citizens as the children thus from the moment a woman conceives the leaders(parents), are told and the pregnancy is celebrated by the entire community as this pregnancy will add another member to the family. The birth of a new member is very significant for the community, as it belongs to the community, not just the parents (page 148, line 9-11). Both women takes care of their bodies and health to ensure that their infants are healthy. In both cultures the women work during their pregnancy. Both women has followed the culture passed down from their mothers. Both women see pregnancy physical and spiritual, Rigoberta sees it as more spiritual because of the culture she was brought up in.
The bottom line is that both senarios are based on the culture, what is thought to you as being the right way of doing things is what you will perceive as being correct and acceptable.
Academic Journal #3, Blog #2 Rosendo Edgar Pacheco.
ReplyDeleteBirth Ceremonies- Rigoberta Mench
"It's as if the mother were a guide explaining things to a tourist." pg 147, ln 27-28
In Birth Ceremonies by Rigoberta Menchu, this sentence caught my attention almost immediately. Imagine, this author is comparing a mother to a tourist. But looking at it carefully this is a very good comparison. Let's analyze it a bit.
Imagine yourself going to St. Hermans cave on the outskirts of Belmopan. It is your first visit and you forgot to book a guide. Upon standing on that big entrance, a new world to you, you become dumbfounded, you don't know where to go and it's pretty dark in there. But, if you had a guide, he could talk you through this darkness and you would be able to find your way.
Well, the baby is also in a cave, all by himself and what the mother does is to speak to him, patting and rubbing the stomach, she is conveying very important messages to the child which will be quite instrumental in how he will operate when he finally exits this dark cave into the real world.
The Indian cultures have their own believe and practice that they should never abuse the nature world and it’s a must to have respect for the natural things the sun, moon, maize the beans the earth, they believed that The Sun is the Father and the Moon is the Mother, and their commitment is to maintain their customs and pass on the secret of their ancestors. For instant in “Birth Ceremony’ According to Rigoberta on the day a baby is conceived both parent of the child needs to consulted with their appointed leaders to have blessings approval of the baby. The child is not only for both parents but is now for the entire community, all ancestors are now a part of the child life and they will now work together as one to teach the child to follow as far as he can his ancestors tradition. The mother make bound with the baby and talk to the child about the natural world. According to Miss Menchu, “When a baby is seventh month, the mother introduces the baby to the natural world, as our customs to tell her to. show her baby the kinds of life she leads, so that if she get up at three in the morning does her chores and tends to the animals, she does it all the more so when she`s pregnant, conscious that the child is taking all this in” pg 147. The girls are taught that their job are to carry water and take care of the home and boys are to fetch horse and do the hard labor they have more responsibilities.
ReplyDeleteIn contrast with” Making Babies” Louise Endrich is basically saying that no matter what soreness and depression a woman goes through in order to bring forth a child in the end the ultimate reward is that of the baby and that making babies is a beautiful thing. She talks about the pain that a woman will have to endure in the process when a baby is conceived up to child’s birth. According to Louise Endrich “women are condemned to pain in child’s labor”. A pregnant woman is subject to stress, depression, some died during child labor, or have to do a c-section, but many have natural birth. However from the day the baby is conceived the mother developed an instant bond with the unborn child they often speech to the child and the love for that child is different of that of another adult. Just a look on the child`s face cease everything, erase all the pain the woman had endure in just a couple second everything had vanish. pg 106
Hi, everyone…my understanding of both stories is that each woman share piece of their own view and knowledge when giving birth to a child. This might just be one of their own experience and difficulties they encounter in live and yes, they might come from different cultures but the pain in bear a child or even losing a child might be the same. In “Making Babies” Louise Erdrich's gives a strong example of her culture while on “Birth Ceremonies” by Rigoberta's highlights that the cultural pressures that exist cause the focus to be more on the community’s relationship with the child. So sharing their personal experiences and observations regarding birth, they have similarities in both stories; still, there are several differences. For example, author Rigoberta Menchu speaks about sacred act when view a child…. You will note that in “Birth Ceremonies” there is a depiction to “Making Babies” of just how strong women are. Page 148, paragraph 2, when Menchu speaks about how her mother hang a rope from the roof and pulled her pregnant sister up and her sister gave birth in that position. This speaks true of just how strong a woman is. A woman has to be extremely strong to give birth while hanging from a roof... this is also showing that the Mayan cultures are warrior they endure pain from as early, ensure that they culture remain as his. Also On page 151, line 17, Menchu said “To us, suffering is our fate, and the child must be introduced to the sorrows and hardship, but he must learn that despite his suffering, he will be respectful and live through his pain.”… This statement was well said by “Rigoberta”….as mention by author the parents in Menchú’s writing are sad that they have brought a child into the world to suffer (p. 151); on the other hand, this thought seems to be absent when Erdrich gives birth. It is more reasonable to say that Erdrich chooses to elaborate on the grief and distress the mother endures rather than the potential difficulties the child will face later on in life. Contrasting what “Rigoberta” said to “Louise Erdrich” emphasized more on the anguish, and pain women go through during the period she is pregnant, after the nine months of carrying the child then she has to go through the labor hoping everything is successful, if everything goes according to plan then she now has to take up the responsibility in taking care of a child and make sure the child keeps pace with the world. By this she is bring up a strong point in which we as parent need to share our own experience with our childrens letting them know how important they are for their mother which endure the pain of agony they go through.
ReplyDeleteErdrich’s personal experiences are concentrated on the importance of the child in the process. Manchu’s focused on the Mayan’s culture tradition from what is done with the child in during pregnancy step by step from the bringing till the end of the 9 months of agony. For instance, there is a contrast between the preparations that are made during pregnancy to welcome the child into the world. On page 147 of “Birth Ceremonies” audience are informed that the mother tells the child how hard life is and apparently acknowledges negative forces that are present. In contrast, “Making Babies” has a more optimistic point of view about life. The parents in Menchú’s writing are sad that they have brought a child into the world to suffer (p. 151); on the other hand, this thought seems to be absent when Erdrich gives birth. Another comparison is that according to Miss Menchu, “When a baby is seventh month, the mother introduces the baby to the natural world, as our customs to tell her to.
Academic Journal #3, blog #2, Birth Ceremonies
ReplyDelete“As it belongs to the community” page 148 line 9-15. This line is interesting because other cultures besides, the Indian culture has this belief of a child belonging to a village not just the parents. Decades ago even in Belize; a child would be raised by neighbors’, family friends etc. Everyone in the community would have the right and responsibility of raising and disciplining a child. These days it’s very different in modern cultures because children are only raised by their parents, and the majority of the time the parents can’t spend quality time with their children because they are working.
The story Birth Ceremonies by Rigoberta states that when a child is born in the Indian community, several members of that community must be present to receive the baby. Three couples should be at the child’s birth, and theses three couples should be specific people such as the village leader, the husbands father etc. The Indian culture emphasizes that the birth of a new member to their community is significant, and that the child is a result of communal love.
Britany Thompson:
ReplyDeletePart II “Protection of Fundamental Rights and Freedoms.” My two topics that I have chosen to explain about fundamental rights and freedom and are as follows:
Fundamental Rights and Freedom:
Fundamental Rights and Freedom basically entails an individual right to say, whatever his race, place of origin, political opinions, colour, creed or sex, but subject to respect for the rights and freedoms of others and for the public interest, to each and all of the following: For instance, life, liberty, security of the person, and the protection of the law; freedom of conscience, of expression and of assembly and association; protection for his family life, his personal privacy, the privacy of his home and other property and recognition of his human dignity;
lastly, protection from arbitrary deprivation of property.
Every citizens, of this nation has the outmost fundamental rights of all of the following mention above, being that they are law abiding citizens. The reason is because they are born Belizean, and wants to feel protected, have the freedom to voice their opinions; and distress if the GOB fails to gives them their services; that they have promised the public. For example the public unions of this nation, like the teachers and union members have protested against the Government; wanted an adjustment for an salary increase for over 10 years. This clearly shows the fundamental rights and freedom being expressed by the teachers nation wide. In the sense that they have not been deprived of their civil rights of expression.
Finally, the fundamental rights and freedom further states according to research; that a person shall not be deprived of his life intentionally save in execution of the sentence of a court in respect of a criminal offence under any law of which he has been convicted. This basically mean that if a person is not guilty of an criminal offence he or she has the fundamental right to defend themselves, and should have the liberty to express themselves.
Protection of Freedom of Movement:
Protection of freedom of movement basically entails the right to move freely within one's own country.Everyone has the right to freedom of movement and residence within the borders of each State. Also everyone has the right to leave any country, including his own, and return to his country.The reason is because there have been numerous cases whereby imigrants of another country cannot leave their country to migrate to another country.
In addition, the right to free movement, or the denial of it, within national and international borders can have profound effects upon other basic human rights. Without the right to leave ones home, an individual may be politically repressed, prevented from observing his or her chosen religion, prevented from enjoying the basic right to marriage or family life, or blocked from a job or an education; that ultimately could enhance that individual's quality of life. Moreover; while free movement may seem on the surface to be a fairly minor and obvious human right; it actually is one of the most basic rights that in many nations around the world, when violated, causes numerous problems and cases of suffering. Hence the reason we as Belizeans has the fundamental right of liberty to migrate to another country without any difficulty. For this we are being bless so we should feel proud to move freely within our country whether regional or international.